.45-70 Government (405gr SP at 1,330fps)(1,590 ft lbs): 35.2 . The Army even ranted against the 30-40 Krag as being ineffective. And whatever you do, never try to approach or touch a dead bear. I had no expectation that the pistol would kill the bear. The larger the gun, and to some extent, the longer the barrel, the less felt recoil and muzzle flip you will experience. Your fat. 44 Magnum For Bear-What you Should Know - eatingthewild.com Having shot a 44 magnum numerous times, I can tell you that it is not one of my favorite range guns. How many people were attacked by humans in the last 40 years? The guys got lucky.. How in the hell did our ancestors kill them with a rock tied on the end of a stick? Then you have to get on target which is easier with a shorter, lighter gun. Remember that 44 mag ammo is not a magic bullet you still need to know how to use it effectively, Make yourself as big and loud as possible; shout and clap your hands, Try to scare the bear away by throwing objects at it or spraying it with pepper spray, If those things dont work, use your firearm to shoot the bear in the most vital areas: its head, chest or neck, The minimum caliber for black bear is .30-06 Springfield, A well placed shot from a .44 Magnum will penetrate both shoulders of a black bear with ease, When hunting black bear, use a rifle with good sights and a scope, Remember that handguns are not as powerful as rifles and may not provide enough penetration on larger bears. What is the title of Craig Boddingtons book? Otherwise, anyone thinking a handgun is good for bear defense should file off the front site and lubricated really well. If only those murderous hunters had been carrying bear spray, that poor bear would still be alive. Hundreds of bear attacks? According to Hornady's data, the XTP bullets from a 7.5-inch barrel clock at 1350 fps and generate . Is it fun to shoot? Wont take too long until you go viral. If you end up underneath a Grizzly that mauling your ass pre-shot and still-biting-you theres a common, two word, phrase for that kind of situation. I wonder what Larry Kelly would have to say about the negative talk here about the Magnaport Stalker handguns that his company builtand he took to Alaska and the African continent to do his testing with it way back in the late 70s or 80s. I dont know if I would call it a design. As for his own writing, yeah, I sure do criticize it. Keep your gun on your hip and always designate one to watch for bears. Nelson killed one of his charging grizzlies with a .454 Casull, which he says is one of his favorite choices for bear defense. A clean kill is the best way to avoid having to track a wounded bear. 3. Aim for the head or heart if possible. And those rifleslike the Marlin 1894 or Ruger 77/44are lightweight, compact, and ideal for hound. .338 Winchester Magnum The favorite among Alaskan guides as a backup gun, the .338 Winchester Magnum was released in 1958 as belted, rimless cartridge. A 9, 38, or 45 isnt an adequate round for something as large as a bear, with think hide, fur and muscles. It wasnt a challenge or snub to anyone, really. Less felt recoil means a delf defense pistol that many small frame shooters can handle. Your comment here is snarky and uneducated. He had a long explanation for why this happens, which I boiled down to two sentences above. You can carry a 9 in bear country if you want, but make sure the sights are filed down! I found the account as I was searching for bear attacks where pistols had been used as a defensive measure. Kim had a Glock model 20 10 mm pistol with him. Other calibers that come to mind are the Desert Eagle in .50 cal and the 10 mm. Chuke tests 44 Mag and 10mm Underwood Extreme Penetrator on his actual Grizzly Bear Skull to dispel the urban myth that a bears skull will ward off these kin. He was a brave soul. And if you want grownups to take you seriously, you really do have to stop sounding just like Jesse Pinkman. Grizzly Bear Charge Stopped with a .44 Magnum ~ VIDEO Copyright 2023 National Rifle Association, Women On Target Instructional Shooting Clinics, Volunteer At The Great American Outdoor Show, Marion P. Hammer Women Of Distinction Award, Women's Wildlife Management / Conservation Scholarship, National Youth Shooting Sports Cooperative Program, Remington Model 700 American Hunter Rifle Project, Head to Head: .338 Winchester Magnum vs. .375 H&H Magnum, Head to Head: .375 Ruger vs. .375 H&H Magnum, Head to Head: .35 Whelen vs. .375 H&H Magnum, Head to Head: 9.3x62mm Mauser vs. .375 H&H Magnum, Behind the Bullet: 7-30 Waters | An Official Journal Of The NRA, Little Guys To The Rescue: Federals Force X2 Shorty Shotshells | An Official Journal Of The NRA, CMP Milsurp Ammo In High Demand, .30 Carbine Online Sales Exhausted In One Week | An NRA Shooting Sports Journal, New For 2023: Winchester 400 Legend | An Official Journal Of The NRA, American Buffalo Introduces Sunset Series Tumble Weed Knife, Redding Reloading Adds Die Set for .300 HAM'R, Hardware: Henry Single Shot Turkey Shotgun, New For 2023: Glock 28 | An Official Journal Of The NRA, First Look: Vortex Razor HD 4000 GB Ballistics Rangefinder | An Official Journal Of The NRA, New for 2023: Henry Rifles Chambered in .360 Buckhammer | An Official Journal Of The NRA, First Look: Henry Big Boy Revolver | An Official Journal Of The NRA, #SundayGunday: Smith & Wesson Model 350 | An Official Journal Of The NRA, #SundayGunday: Ruger American Rimfire Go Wild | An Official Journal Of The NRA, #SundayGunday: Davidson's Weatherby Vanguard Cipher | An Official Journal Of The NRA, Review: SIG Sauer Tango6T And Alpha4 Mount | An Official Journal Of The NRA, 5 Mistakes New Shooters Make | An Official Journal Of The NRA, How to Set Up Your Truck for Hunting | An Official Journal Of The NRA, Exploded View: Mauser K98k | An Official Journal Of The NRA, Review: Frankford Arsenal X-10 Progressive Press | An Official Journal Of The NRA, Members Hunt: A Priceless Deer | An Official Journal Of The NRA, Putting the HammerDown | An Official Journal Of The NRA, Twist Rate: How Hornady's 7mm PRC Fared in Africa | An Official Journal Of The NRA, American Hunter 2023 Golden Bullseye Award Winners | An Official Journal Of The NRA, New for 2023: Primary Arms Optics SLx and GLx | An Official Journal Of The NRA, Springfield Launches New Online Shopping Experience | An Official Journal Of The NRA, Find More Great NRA Publications Perfect For Every Interest, Discover Everything That The NRA Has To Offer. Show me on the doll where the handgun touched you. All of your comments are irrelevant. Presumably he removed it when they started cleaning the moose, which is probably the worst time to do so. If youre ever faced with a bear attack, youll need to know how to defend yourself. Question: What Is The Best 44 Magnum Bullet For Deer Hunting I've killed big bear with one shot (usually .338 mag) but I was also in on a bear kill with my hunting partner when things didn't go well. The hunters violated the most basic safety rule when cleaning game to pack out. Big credit to the guy finding his calm in that situation; it allowed him to place a well aimed shot . Best thing in the world? If you are carrying a handgun for self-protection against black bear, be sure to practice with it beforehand so that you are proficient in its use. .300 Remington Ultra Magnum (180gr Nosler Partition at 3,243fps)(4,202 ft lbs): 25.7 Black bears are responsible for more human deaths and mauling s than griz and brown bear combined! He includes several photographs. Defense Against Bears with Pistols: 97% Success rate, 37 Incidents Bruh it's a black bear not a Grizzly. For many backwoods trekkers, hunters, and homesteaders the 44 mag is the mainstay of their bear defense. But energy doesn't kill animals, tissue damage kills them. Backpack straps and holstered guns dont get along well. Stay safe out there! You might have learned that if you didnt try to snub total strangers over the internet and instead tried to speak as intelligently as the author just did when he disputed my claims just now. His raging confrontational writing style that relies upon fabricated facts, is so close to his that I wouldnt be surprised if it was revealed that he indeed is actually my nephew. DO NOT SEE THE MTN LIONS MUCH BUT THEY ARE OUT THERE AS SEE THE TRACKS AND A GLANCE OUT THE WINDOW ONCE IN A WHILE. What is a Threaded Barrel and What Does it Do? I live in a small native village in bush Alaska. Thankfully he decided to scale the cliff because it was a good 20 seconds or more before I could undo the straps to my rifle and get it pointed in his direction. However, if we are considering the average person on an outdoor adventure, we need to look at the best fit option. Alaskan Grizzly Bear Attack Demonstrates Effectiveness of .44 Magnum I NEVER SLING OR STRAP MY SMOKE POLE, ALWAYS IN HAND AND PISTOL NOT SECURED UNLESS DOING SOMETHING WHEN IT COULD FALL OUT IF TUMBLE. I know hunters who routinely carry a bear defense pistol that they have never shot. They almost never attack . Startled bears can be extremely volatile as can those with a fresh kill if they perceive that you are threatening to take their dinner. It immediately blew enough of it back in my own face that had it been a defensive use, it would have made matters worse. Unfortunately, most everything else on this page is hogwash! As a wildcat cartridge, it hasnt seen the widespread use of other rounds on this list, but that hasnt stopped many guides and hunters, Nelson included, from converting Marlin lever guns for its very effective use. As stated by Marshall and Sanow in Stopping Power, As a general trend, and all else being equal, stopping power increases as the size of the recovered bullet increases., In addition, their table Caliber Comparison on page 335 shows a significant advantage for .45 ACP over .38.special. Pistolero Magazine in the 1980s when shooting barnyard hogs found that there was no difference in killing power between the .357 magnum, .45 acp, 38 special and 919. The second and third time I used bear spray was against overly aggressive dogs. Even bear spray would make more sense than peeving it off. While not stated in the account, one of the pictures indicates the first, crucial shot, was to the center of the bears chest. akgunners command of language, his clarity of thought, and his thinking were just superb today. As with anything, the devil is in the details. Some others are .50 Desert Eagle, .454 Casull, .500 Smith & Wesson Magnum and the .480 Ruger. in Southern Cal., I have been on many gangland shootings involving the 9mm.While it does have the necessary power to kill people, as often as not, people survive being shot with this caliber.The last call involving a 9mm, the victim was shot 15 times and was still fighting us to get up off the gurney and get some payback. They must have been some real badasses. The mot popular cartridge used against bears in terms of this compilation was the .44 Magnum, which is often cited by internet and forum warriors as the absolute smallest you should go in bear defense. We must not have read the same post. Yes, the 7mm Remington Magnum is A GOOD CHOICE for grizzly or brown bear hunting, under average conditions, from a mid-range distance, with a medium grain expanding bullet, and with correct shot placement. That sentence wasnt even English. Believe it or not those that used pepper spray or just played dead survived more than those that pulled out hand guns and blazed away. Dude you should stop before you have a heart attack. Ive clearly enraged you to the point where your more of a danger to yourself and others. When youre out in the wild, its important to be prepared for anything. At that distance, a shooter has roughly four seconds to make a charge-stopping shot, which requires a steady hand under intense pressure. I grew up half the time in Alaska and the other half in Seattle. You have access to the Internets, just as others do. Ruger chambers the .454 Casull in both the Super Redhawk with a 4-inch barrel and the Alaskan in a 3-inch variant, both of which are compact and easy to draw when things get up close and personal. Aim is critical too and handguns just arent accurate, nor can they match a rifle let alone a a rifle that needs hard cast bullets for this job anyways. Yes Im sure youve read 12,000 books on bear attacks and subscribe to bear attack monthly while you work out to bear attack shows. Does that (true, b.t.w.) test, none of us were looking forward to running the S&W 329 PD with the Hornady 240-grain JHP loads I had brought along. WE HAVE WOLVES, MTN LIONS AND BEARS APLENTY AROUND MY ELK CAMP. The dog did nothing more than backup, sneeze, and trot away. AK: Kim Woodman Kills Charging Grizzly with 10 mm 29 July, 2016 On 29 July, 2016, about 4 p.m. Kim Woodman was attacked by a sow brown bear at Humpy Creek. Value. I DO GET THAT:) I think akgunner wrote a comment below the article which is more helpful than the article itself. You should be using slugs, and not just your average deer slug but hot ones, and you can forget about buckshot. In the ever-evolving world of social media, we are constantly looking for new ways to connect with our readers. Very difficult to do, but an absolute guaranteed instant stopper. In a .44 Magnum a 240-grain JSP or a 220-grain or heavier silhouette-style bullet like Federal loads commercially and other bullet makers offer for handloading are also fine choices. People claim there are multiple instances where people with pistols failed to stop the attack and/or kill the bear. Bear Gun Shootout: 10mm Auto vs 44 Mag. | Outdoor Life I know a guy who emptied his 9mm into a Black Bearkilled it well enough. . Now how many other domestic animals such as pets have been taken, is anyones guess. Now do what I did when I was wrong last week. Lessons learned . Penetration is key, so hard cast lead is the way to go. As the bear charge drill in his course demonstrates, the average bear attack will happen at 50 yards or less with an 800-pound animal moving at 30 mph. I lived in AK for a number of years in the early 70s and whenever I went fishing I carried a .44 magnum. It is better to have and not need than to need and not have, in my opinion. Next to Bison, they are the second largest cause of fatalities and mauling s in Yellowstone Park. Good placement and a heavy bullet at a decent speed. In general, you should always try to avoid any conflict with bears if possible. Nelson continues to teach a bear defense course in Alaska, instructing geologists and representatives from other government agencies how to operate a wide variety of firearms platforms in a bear defense situation. The period of time for their data set was from 1883 to 2009. I heard that bear was a friend of Cecil the lion. Honestly cant remember ever having an issue taking grizz with a 44 mag (Ruger super Blackhawk) . As he fell, he bit at the ground and ended up with a mouthful of sod. (Another was uncovered after I wrote the last article.) This attack makes29 pistol defenses against bears that I have found. 357 Mag, and says, when it comes to handguns and bears, what matters is getting the most hits on target in the shortest amount of time. To give folks working in dangerous animal country a very portable self defense tool. When it comes to defending yourself against a bear attack, theres no substitute for 44 mag ammo. It was day 3 of the hunt and we decided to head home due to adverse weather. From thegreatwhitehunter.com: When Reed distracted the bear from its attack on me, I had time to concentrate on the holster. Can you kill a grizzly with a 9mm? - Good hunting Proper 9mm bullets yield sufficient penetration in soft tissue, but it may not stop a bear quickly enough to avoid being mauled. Zero. I can spare you some. Make sure to practice with your chosen firearm beforehand, and always check local regulations when traveling in bear country. The bears run in and out of the visual field of the video camera. Ive watched, while working out, flossing, but never sittingI dont sit while I watch TVpretty much every documentary on bears ever shown, including the one on crazy, brave, brilliant, dead Timothy Treadwell. What did work was the short barrel shotgun. 2. . Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. However, the goal of this article is simply to address the question of whether the .300 Winchester Magnum is within the ideal range of suitable calibers to harvest grizzly or brown bear. I forgot to mention it, and you should get credit where credit is due. Ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding!!! Yes you do want a magnum. Heres a look at the eight best charge-stopping bear cartridges ever made. I have always acknowledged your educational and army background and qualifications when Ive criticized you. Its the statement of a man who has experience, understanding, and appreciation. I recommend training and study before using. The 44 magnum does deliver less energy on target than the other calibers in our comparison tables. My Grizzly Ed? LOL . And Im sick with the flu,so Im goofing off in this pathetic comments section. There are other handguns in larger calibers that deliver more energy on target. .600 Nitro Express (900gr Kynoch solid at 2,000fps)(7992 ft lbs): 159.4, *** Elmer Keith developed it to hunt AK Brown bears. This div height required for enabling the sticky sidebar, 2022 Yestactical.com We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites. LAST TIME CALLED BUFFALO BORE GOT THE OWNER AND MUCH TALK AND HELP ON CARBINE AND PISTOL ROUNDS NEEDED FOR A SITUATION SINCE I AM ARMED ESCORT FOR LIVING. Hes read some books so hes an expert. Im referring to the Trending now BS. .454 Casull Developed by Dick Casull and Jack Fulmer in 1957, the .454 Casull is a dangerous game hunters dream come true. JUST CALLED THEM ON THE PHONE AND MOST HELPFUL. However, if you are dealing with an especially large or aggressive bear, you may need something more powerful. I stood in a dumbfounded stupor. His father has tried in vain to get this sad lad committed to a psychiatric treatment facility for years with zero success. Heres an excerpt. All of that being said, in my past 4 years in Alaska, you know how many times Ive been attacked by a bear? I come back again to accuracy rather than bullet size. What happened? It wasnt even language. Upon second thought, I think you just honestly misunderstood my meaning, and I may have misunderstood yours in the reply I just wrote. Its also capable of sending a massive projectile, like Buffalo Bores 430-grain hard-cast bullet, at roughly 2000 fps and 3,600 ft.-lbs. Lets face it. TTAG has lots of writers who are smarter than him when it comes to the woods and guns. People arent buying snubbies in big calibers for this kind of situation any more than theyre buying large knives because they want to join that one guy who actually did kill a grizzly with a Ka-Bar. Never had to shoot a bear with it, and hope it stays that way, but pretty confident it will do the trick if needed. You still need to know how to use it effectively in order to maximize its potential. Just How Would You Stop a Charging Bear? | Grand View Outdoors BLACK BEARS: A charging grizzly bear can reach speeds of 35 mph an hour for short distances and their acceleration rate is phenomenal. 7. CALLED BUFFALO BOAR AND USING ONE OF ROUNDS THEY RECOMMENDED FOR MY SITUATION AND BEARS. Very few handguns can stop a 600 lb. 7mm Remington Magnum for Grizzly Or Brown Bear Hunting? Best Ammo Great story. .30-06 and.300 Win were the results. We have a winner! {vacant stare}, I have lived and hunted here in Alaska for 40+years, have been face to face with bears here on a few occasions, Black, Brown, Grizzly, And Polar, Every encounter was different, only once, (so far) have I had a have to shoot situation, My hunting partner (from lower 48) and I had boated up a wonderful wilderness river, and everywhere we stopped, was covered with bear tracks, (Grizzly) ( we were Moose hunting) We stopped and made a fire and had dinner, just after dinner (8PM) my partner says BEAR!! That means having the right gear, and knowing how to use it. Polar bear attacks are expected there, and tourists are not allowed unless they carry a high powered firearm. Want to feel fear for the right reasons? 3) Self defense from a bear attack with a pistol is a cautionary tale at best, correct? When grizzlies threaten, North Country sportmen pick up long guns, not revolvers. The beauty of the .454, however, is that you can practice with .45 Colt rounds and save yourself a bit of recoil trauma. Alaskan Grizzly Bear Attack Demonstrates Effectiveness of .44 Magnum, How to Horrify the Mainstream Media in One Easy Step, Gun Review: Springfield Armory Ronin EMP 3 9mm 1911, https://www.nrafamily.org/articles/2017/7/6/handguns-for-defense-in-bear-country/, https://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2014/04/140415-black-bear-florida-attack-habitat-wildlife-conservation/, http://www.leverguns.com/articles/paco/41heavy.htm, https://leeprecision.com/mold-6-cav-c430-310-rf.html. Human beings in the woods. 2. I spray with mine regularly, even though I have to buy a lot more of it, both for practice and for making sure its as potent as can be. Quora - A place to share knowledge and better understand the world Underwood Extreme Penetrator test on an Actual Grizzly Skull 10mm vs 44 mag 5. Of which he found 29 accounts. Im not criticizing him for that, but he didnt say it was his research. That same bullet in a .357 Magnum exits a four-inch barrel upwards of 1,400 fps. NAM TAUGHT ME SH#T, SHOWER, SHAVE, SLEEP WITH WEAPON. Actually looking for 300 grain .411 hardcast. Some of these guys are border line genius. Your personal decision to sit on your ass too much. Why the Alaskan was designed as a snubbie? In this case, 44 magnum ammo tends to be much less expensive than the other large specialty calibers of ammunition suitable for bear defense. The key to using .44 Magnum to successfully stop a large grizzly bear attack is using heavy, hardcast lead bullets and having a 6+ inch barrel to boost muzzle velocity (over short-barreled revolvers). If I had to camp for the night. You have avoided your burden of proof, and I have a problem with that. As his head sagged to the ground, I shot him three more times in quick succession, out of fear and anger. Like a man. Aim for the center of mass whenever possible in order to ensure a quick and clean kill. A bear is not a human and self-defense rounds are not as effective on a bear as you might expect. That which is asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence. Tyler Freel A 12 gauge's effectiveness can vary tremendously based on the ammunition used. This way it wont hurt you as much when the bear shoves it where the sun dont shine. Id like to see Boddingtons sources for hundreds of attacks. However, most bear encounters are under less than perfect conditions. They must have been some real badasses.. Bears can be very dangerous when theyre angry, so its best to stay out of their reach. Be be over armed -not under. The Glock 20 chambered in 10mm has become a popular carry choice in bear country. I WAS STILL PRETTY DANGEROUS WHEN WOUNDED AND SAME APPLIES TO BEAR. American Buffalo Knife and Tool Co. is adding to its line of Roper Knives with the new Sunset Series Tumble Weed. I doubt any bear could withstand two quick rounds from this one to the head! I am looking forward to seeing them. I had no expectation that the pistol would kill the bear. The dog was close enough however that the spray did hit the dog right in the face. cartridges like 7mm Rem, which are both versatile and dependable. It was pretty much a niche round til Dirty Harry. .375 H&H (300gr Hornady DGX at 2,530fps)(4,263 ft lbs): 40.7 A bear spray salesman. There are other downsides to carrying larger firearms that may not pose as big a problem for some people. SEPARATE FOOTNOTES WHICH ARE NOT A COMMENT ON THIS ARTICLE: . 44 Magnum ammo should do the trick though! DO NOT GO INTO LOT ABOUT GRAINS AND SUCH AS I THINK THESE INDIVIDUAL CHOICES BASED ON SHOOTERS PREFERENCE AND SITUATION. These are the most vulnerable areas on a bear. Unless and until you provide evidence to support the claim, thats all it is; a claim. Who knows. .357 S&W MagnumWhile some folks claim the .44 Magnum is the minimum for charging bears, many others have opted for a Glock 20 in 10mm Auto and, interestingly enough, passed right by the .357 S&W Magnum. Need to read Elmer Keiths accounts of animal attacks in Hell, I was there. Likely a happy accident for them due other evolutionary happenstances, but they are around because the weaker ones arent. The .44 magnum boomed in the night and the boar fell straight down, his head three feet away from where I stood. Over the decades, several cartridges have proved themselves as worthy against the nastiest bears North America has to offer. I was driving along an overland trail, about to cross a small creek and pop back out onto the beach of our lake. .50 Alaskan Taking a .348 Winchester case and necking it out to accept a .510-inch, Alaskan Harold Johnson was able to successfully convert a Winchester Model 1886 rifle into a .50-caliber, bear-killing machine. NOT UNUSUAL TO HAVE BEARS CLOSE TO CABIN EATING BERRIES OR GETTING A DRINK. The statistics lie with the .44 magnum as an effective handgun against a grizzly bear attack. Bear spray is worthless Ive used it three times. WHEN FURTHER A FIELD ALSO CARRY MARLIN SS 1895 LEVER WITH BUFFALO BORE RECOMMENDED ROUND IN 45-70. 2. I was awfully struck by the Santa Cruz mountains-area hiking book I read. In his research of hundreds of bear attacks the people who used handguns usually did not survive the attack. Keep in mind that you might need a Magnum load to propel a heavy bullet to a decent velocity. 44 Mag Ammo for Bear: Protect Yourself in the Wild Well thought-out, well-researched, and well-said. SEE IT. Center Mass hits can disrupt the circulatory system, but science has proven that enough blood remains in a humans system that they can continue to act for up to about 10 seconds. 44 mag ammo can help you do just that. Grizzly bears can operate much longer that humans due to the way their circulatory system/muscles work. Hes seen a large grizzly remain upright and functional for 90 seconds to 2 minutes after taking a fatal chest shot. The comparative recoil data shows the difference between our chosen calibers.